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	<title>Comments on: Going completely mentor!</title>
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	<link>http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/2009/07/07/going-completely-mentor/</link>
	<description>on music composition and production, filmmaking, and creativity</description>
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		<title>By: admin</title>
		<link>http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/2009/07/07/going-completely-mentor/comment-page-1/#comment-4727</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 17:40:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/?p=175#comment-4727</guid>
		<description>Thanks for your comments, George!

One thing that is definitely sure is that mentoring can take many different forms, and does not necessarily happen within the confines of the academic setting.  Many composers are &#039;self-taught&#039; and did not go through a formal musical education.  The networking aspect of attending post-secondary education cannot be underestimated, and in my opinion is one of the biggest reasons to choose that route.  You become connected to a system of peers on which you will come to rely, and your teachers act as mentors, and can introduce you to others who will act as mentors.  I, like you, am self taught (in terms of composing for media/arrangement/orchestration), and have had and continue to build my network up through a lot of hard work and not a little luck.  If you are serious about what you do, and are driven by passion to constantly improve and work at your craft, you will eventually run into the right people that can help you out.  It&#039;s like any opportunity - you have to recognize it (sometimes they come in mysterious forms!), and be ready for it when it comes along.  It is more challenging in the field of composing for media, mostly because it has become so unbelievably saturated with those looking to break in.  The key I think is to figure out what your value is - what do you offer someone who might be in a position to act as a mentor?  

Your comment regarding a &#039;network of peers and friends&#039; is definitely a good one.  I talk about this in another blog, &lt;a href=&quot;http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/?p=136&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&#039;Ducks and Champions&#039;&lt;/a&gt; - the value of surrounding yourself with people who act as a support, and who believe in what you do.  It&#039;s so important.  Having trusted voices who can critique your work in a constructive way, while making you feel that you are making progress is also key to sustaining your activities as an artist of any kind.  One thing I would suggest is different, is that your friends and peers do not have the hard-won and time tested practical knowledge and insight of an experienced professional.  They are the ones who do, not just talk/read about doing.  The feeling of working under someone like this is that expectations/beliefs can be shattered, and you&#039;ll need to dig deeper to perform than ever before.

I remember when I first started thinking about having a mentor, I said &quot;I&#039;m going to mentor under Mychael Danna - he&#039;s just the right guy for me.  I&#039;ll meet him in the grocery aisle and we&#039;ll hit it off!&quot;.  Ha ha ha!  I think that my bold statement had more to do with being naive than a &#039;shoot for the stars&#039; kind of attitude.  My point here is, there is plenty to learn and many people who can help you at all stages of the game.  If you approach someone at the right time with the right offer of value, it&#039;s pretty likely they&#039;ll be flattered enough to take you up on it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your comments, George!</p>
<p>One thing that is definitely sure is that mentoring can take many different forms, and does not necessarily happen within the confines of the academic setting.  Many composers are &#8217;self-taught&#8217; and did not go through a formal musical education.  The networking aspect of attending post-secondary education cannot be underestimated, and in my opinion is one of the biggest reasons to choose that route.  You become connected to a system of peers on which you will come to rely, and your teachers act as mentors, and can introduce you to others who will act as mentors.  I, like you, am self taught (in terms of composing for media/arrangement/orchestration), and have had and continue to build my network up through a lot of hard work and not a little luck.  If you are serious about what you do, and are driven by passion to constantly improve and work at your craft, you will eventually run into the right people that can help you out.  It&#8217;s like any opportunity &#8211; you have to recognize it (sometimes they come in mysterious forms!), and be ready for it when it comes along.  It is more challenging in the field of composing for media, mostly because it has become so unbelievably saturated with those looking to break in.  The key I think is to figure out what your value is &#8211; what do you offer someone who might be in a position to act as a mentor?  </p>
<p>Your comment regarding a &#8216;network of peers and friends&#8217; is definitely a good one.  I talk about this in another blog, <a href="http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/?p=136" rel="nofollow">&#8216;Ducks and Champions&#8217;</a> &#8211; the value of surrounding yourself with people who act as a support, and who believe in what you do.  It&#8217;s so important.  Having trusted voices who can critique your work in a constructive way, while making you feel that you are making progress is also key to sustaining your activities as an artist of any kind.  One thing I would suggest is different, is that your friends and peers do not have the hard-won and time tested practical knowledge and insight of an experienced professional.  They are the ones who do, not just talk/read about doing.  The feeling of working under someone like this is that expectations/beliefs can be shattered, and you&#8217;ll need to dig deeper to perform than ever before.</p>
<p>I remember when I first started thinking about having a mentor, I said &#8220;I&#8217;m going to mentor under Mychael Danna &#8211; he&#8217;s just the right guy for me.  I&#8217;ll meet him in the grocery aisle and we&#8217;ll hit it off!&#8221;.  Ha ha ha!  I think that my bold statement had more to do with being naive than a &#8217;shoot for the stars&#8217; kind of attitude.  My point here is, there is plenty to learn and many people who can help you at all stages of the game.  If you approach someone at the right time with the right offer of value, it&#8217;s pretty likely they&#8217;ll be flattered enough to take you up on it!</p>
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		<title>By: George Panayotou</title>
		<link>http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/2009/07/07/going-completely-mentor/comment-page-1/#comment-4725</link>
		<dc:creator>George Panayotou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 15:53:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adrianelliscomposer.com/AdriansBlog/?p=175#comment-4725</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a shade conflicted on this topic. I believe mentoring is perhaps as important to an artist&#039;s life as say, a good father/mother figure is to a child&#039;s life. The two are very analogous if you look at it. In the early stages of artistic endeavor there are a lot of learning experiences; essentially, mistakes to be made, and having a mentor there is a huge boon to the artist in that it sort of fast-tracks their growth by having someone more experienced to bounce ideas off of but, more typically, to give context to things they may be doing without knowing it. 

I&#039;m not a trained musician, however, so my mentors have basically been people that I admire, but that, unfortunately doesn&#039;t seem to provide the potentially accessible network that you refer to as one of the benefits that can be provided by a mentor in the classical sense of the word. That is a contradiction, however, because mentors existed before traditional schools of education were established. If one wanted to be a blacksmith, they would have to approach one and ask if they could learn their trade. I think it&#039;s a little different now; partly because the arts are taught in schools now more than ever, I think one can achieve that same kind of learning through a network of peers and friends. The benefit of having that kind of group is that it inspires healthy competition (or not depending on if you have a jerk in the group) and an interplay of ideas. I admit, I often yearned for the person who would take me by the hand and say, &quot;You&#039;re writing sucks here and here, but here you have some good things going on&quot;.
I believe it&#039;s just as difficult if you&#039;re in a classically trained atmosphere to obtain a mentor that will guide you. Although I&#039;m not familiar with the obstacles present in that context, I can say in the self-taught realm they are people who are busy with their own work/lives, people just not willing to share their jealously guarded &#039;secrets&#039;, and the overall lack of organization for the autodidactically inclined. 
Interesting blog, Adrian. I enjoyed your work on Mobius. The decisions you made were sensible and given the type of film it is, the score works to its advantage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a shade conflicted on this topic. I believe mentoring is perhaps as important to an artist&#8217;s life as say, a good father/mother figure is to a child&#8217;s life. The two are very analogous if you look at it. In the early stages of artistic endeavor there are a lot of learning experiences; essentially, mistakes to be made, and having a mentor there is a huge boon to the artist in that it sort of fast-tracks their growth by having someone more experienced to bounce ideas off of but, more typically, to give context to things they may be doing without knowing it. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not a trained musician, however, so my mentors have basically been people that I admire, but that, unfortunately doesn&#8217;t seem to provide the potentially accessible network that you refer to as one of the benefits that can be provided by a mentor in the classical sense of the word. That is a contradiction, however, because mentors existed before traditional schools of education were established. If one wanted to be a blacksmith, they would have to approach one and ask if they could learn their trade. I think it&#8217;s a little different now; partly because the arts are taught in schools now more than ever, I think one can achieve that same kind of learning through a network of peers and friends. The benefit of having that kind of group is that it inspires healthy competition (or not depending on if you have a jerk in the group) and an interplay of ideas. I admit, I often yearned for the person who would take me by the hand and say, &#8220;You&#8217;re writing sucks here and here, but here you have some good things going on&#8221;.<br />
I believe it&#8217;s just as difficult if you&#8217;re in a classically trained atmosphere to obtain a mentor that will guide you. Although I&#8217;m not familiar with the obstacles present in that context, I can say in the self-taught realm they are people who are busy with their own work/lives, people just not willing to share their jealously guarded &#8217;secrets&#8217;, and the overall lack of organization for the autodidactically inclined.<br />
Interesting blog, Adrian. I enjoyed your work on Mobius. The decisions you made were sensible and given the type of film it is, the score works to its advantage.</p>
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